defender of truth

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Posts by defender of truth

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  6

  Do you know someone who is going to the Elders school 2017, in any country?

  by defender of truth in

  1. watchtower
  2. child-abuse

  an informant in spanish forum, active elder in a congregation in madrid (spain) has posted new info regarding elders school 2017. important changes are to be done for "child" or sexual abuses.

  https://abusostj.vbulletin.net/forum/main-forum/audiencias-judiciales/5506-escuela-de-ancianos-2017.

  doing a summary:.

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  defender of truth

  I don't know (can't care less either).
  

  Hello scratchme.

  I agree with the rest of what you said, but that first sentence is an unusual response.

  I care what instructions that elders are being given, as to how to handle sexual abuse cases.

  I suspect these might not be the only changes. Also, unless this can be verified by someone who has been to the school,there may be some inaccuracy. You never know. (Not that I am suggesting I don't believe it, it is covering them legally, as Scratchme said. Which is typical behaviour for this Org. There is nothing there to show concern for the victim..)

  I hope that you have never been through a 'elders inquisition' after an attack, or that it has happened a member of your family, but I know how stressful they can be. Putting a form in front of someone to sign after they have been discussing such painful and traumatic things, in order to cover themselves from being sued, is rather callous in my view.

  In my view, how these cases are going to be handled is important.

  How victims are treated is important.

  I want to know if this will be a Worldwide practice. Then we can start to get the word out there..

  I wonder what the ARC would think of this?
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  6

  Do you know someone who is going to the Elders school 2017, in any country?

  by defender of truth in

  1. watchtower
  2. child-abuse

  an informant in spanish forum, active elder in a congregation in madrid (spain) has posted new info regarding elders school 2017. important changes are to be done for "child" or sexual abuses.

  https://abusostj.vbulletin.net/forum/main-forum/audiencias-judiciales/5506-escuela-de-ancianos-2017.

  doing a summary:.

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  defender of truth

  sp74bb

  Hello to all,

  An informant in Spanish forum, active elder in a congregation in Madrid (Spain) has posted new info regarding Elders School 2017. Important changes are to be done for "child" or sexual abuses. https://abusostj.vbulletin.net/forum/main-forum/audiencias-judiciales/5506-escuela-de-ancianos-2017

  Doing a summary:

  - New changes are being check by the lawyers at this moment.

  - Changes are held in order to fulfill European laws.

  - Once exposed to a sexual abuse, when the judicial committee starts, the ones present must listened and read a statement stating that applying the state law of the country the victims can report to the authorities.

  - The victim might be asked to sign a statement according he/she is aware of the possibility to report to the authorities.

  - The signed statement or the info that the victim can report to the authorities will be held inside the "Do not destroy" envelope.
  

  www.jehovahs-witness.com/topic/5660066994716672/elders-school-2017-new-instructions-handle-sexual-abuses
  

  Many thanks to sp74bb.

  Will these directions be given at all Elder schools in 2017?
  

  If you know of anyone who is attending this school, or you will be yourself, please can you post on this thread?

  Just to say that you know someone who is going to the school, and in what country.

  We would all really appreciate it if you could report back with any details.

  I am wondering if this will be a worldwide action.

  (Please bump this to the top occasionally).
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  23

  Elders School 2017: New instructions to handle sexual abuses?

  by sp74bb in

  1. watchtower
  2. child-abuse

  an informant in spanish forum, active elder in a congregation in madrid (spain) has posted new info regarding elders school 2017. important changes are to be done for "child" or sexual abuses.

  https://abusostj.vbulletin.net/forum/main-forum/audiencias-judiciales/5506-escuela-de-ancianos-2017.

  doing a summary:.

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  defender of truth

  Thank you for sharing this and translating for us.

  Is there any good reason to believe that this will be standard practice for all EU states?

  We need more insider elders going to schools across EU.

  Would it help if someone started a thread, saying something like:

  "If you know someone who is going to the Elders school 2017 and might tell you what they heard, in any country, please post here"?

  Then we'd know who to ask and could collate the reports.

  The OP of this thread could be quoted to get things started..
  
• 
  754

  Theists, why does God allow suffering..

  by The Quiet One in

  1. watchtower
  2. bible

  ..specifically, the suffering of animals.

  you can talk about free will/sin/people choosing to not listen to god etc to explain human suffering being allowed.. but how can you love a god that allows animals, that haven't sinned or chosen to not have anything to do with god, to have their short lives ended in often long, drawn out, painful ways.

  i could list stories i've read that would probably make you feel ill, but i'm not looking to shock anyone or start an emotional debate.

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  defender of truth

  This will be my final word on the subject...
  

  The Watchtower has always used Adamic sin to explain why God allows all humans to inevitably suffer and die, but this teaching does not explain why animals have always suffered and died.

  The Watchtower teaches that whilst humans were meant to live forever, animals have always grown old and died, without even a hope of resurrection.

  This seems to contradict their teaching of a loving and caring God, who designed the earth to be a wonderful place for humans and animals to live, a God who only allows his creatures to suffer because of the sin committed by Adam and Eve.

  The Watchtower teaches that God originally created the earth as a place of peace and security for mankind, without any threat to humans from predators. Humans would live forever, free of disease and pain. It was only Adamic sin that ended this supposed hope of everlasting life on earth without having to grow old and die.

  Yet animals have never had such an idyllic existence, even before Adam and Eve sinned.

  Animals have been hunting and killing each other for thousands, if not millions, of years before humans existed.

  They have also suffered from disease for many years before humans existed.

  A sample of the evidence that animals were suffering from disease (such as arthritis), long before Adamic sin occurred, can be found here:

  www.jwfacts.com/watchtower/blog/animals-suffering.php

  www.sciencemag.org/news/2016/08/70-million-years-later-duck-billed-dinosaur-has-diagnosis-septic-arthritis

  www.dailymail.co.uk/sciencetech/article-2144715/The-dinosaurs-suffered-arthritis-150-million-years-ago--scientists-find.html
  

  www.mirrordaily.com/dinosaur-suffered-from-arthritis/
  

  Even the animals who have been fortunate enough to avoid suffering caused by predators and diseases, have inevitably had to experience the ageing process, hence suffering and death.
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  19

  Informative Article-The Guardian: Police expect 30,000 new child abuse reports from Goddard inquiry

  by AndersonsInfo in

  1. watchtower
  2. child-abuse

  http://www.theguardian.com/uk-news/2016/may/19/child-sex-abuse-police-expect-30000-goddard-inquiry-cases.

  police expect 30,000 new child abuse reports from goddard inquiry .

  sandra laville.

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  defender of truth

  @Vidiot

  @Simon

  As in Australia, Northern Ireland, Jersey and Scotland, the level of public concern has resulted in calls for an overarching inquiry to look at the big picture, to learn the lessons of the past, to take stock of child protection procedures that are currently in operation, and to set a new course for the future.

  In conducting its work, the Inquiry is liaising with the Australian Royal Commission into Institutional Child Sexual Abuse, with the Independent Jersey Care Inquiry, with the Historical Institutional Abuse Inquiry in Northern Ireland, and with the Scottish Inquiry into Historical Abuse of Children in Care. Together the inquiries have much to learn from each other.

  https://www.iicsa.org.uk/about-us/background
  

  The jw organisation is not part of the main investigations at this point, they are focusing on the Anglican and Catholic churches. I have emailed them to ask them to look at JW's, but they may not have time in their schedule.

  They are open to looking into other organisations though, in the future, so who knows?

  These 13 investigations constitute the first phase of the Inquiry’s work and further investigations will be announced as the Inquiry progresses.

  https://www.iicsa.org.uk/investigations

  To anybody reading this..

  If anyone wants to share information with the Inquiry regarding how abuse is handled within the org, or maybe ask them if they might be able to look at the Jehovahs Witnesses next, you can do so confidentially.

  "If you wish to ask a question about the Inquiry or if you have information to support our investigations please get in touch:
  

  https://www.iicsa.org.uk/contact-us
  

  Or if you want to help by sharing your experience.

  Share your experience

  Sharing your information will help us to investigate how institutions failed to protect children from sexual abuse. This part of our work is called the Truth Project. Watch our Truth Project video to find out more about how the Inquiry will work.
  

  We want to hear from:
  

  anyone who was sexually abused as a child in an institutional setting like a care home, a school or a religious, community or state organisation, or who first came into contact with their abuser in an institutional setting
  

  anyone who was sexually abused as a child, and reported their sexual abuse to a person in authority, like a police officer or teacher, where the report was ignored or not properly acted on

  https://www.iicsa.org.uk/share-your-experience
  
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  22

  UK: Would anyone like to attend Frank Otuo's next hearing against the Watchtower? Or send him your support?

  by defender of truth in

  1. watchtower
  2. scandals

  www.standard.co.uk/news/jehovahs-witness-sues-for-150000-after-church-snubbed-him-over-fraud-claims-9750062.htmlfrank otuo is suing the watchtower for disfellowshipping him and causing the loss of his family and his friends, after being disfellowshipped based on a false accusation of fraud.on friday may 13th 2016, a hearing will take place to decide whether the watchtower's defence will be thrown out.otuo is confident that it will be.

  ;)would anyone like to be there on the day, to see what happens and maybe even report back and tell us what you saw?.

  otuo would like it if some people could be there to cheer him on, as it were.

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  defender of truth

  @akromo

  Is there a report available yet?

  Thank you.
  
• 
  33

  78 to go and hopefully something good comes of it. Please do your part and sign up. Thanks

  by Tenacious in

  1. watchtower
  2. child-abuse

  only 78 signatures are needed in order to send the request to the irs that they revoke or at the very least investigate the borg.

  come'on guys, support it.. click here to support and sign up!.

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  defender of truth

  Sorry, I may not have expressed that clearly enough.

  The blood policy does obviously endanger children's lives, and they may not make an informed and voluntary decision.

  But it is not the responsibility of the IRS to look at what a religion teaches, which is the only link between the parents decision to refuse blood and the org's policy.

  Frankly, I have doubts that even covering up child abuse will be looked into by the IRS.

  All they seem to be concerned with is political campaigning.

  https://www.irs.gov/charities-non-profits/charitable-organizations/the-restriction-of-political-campaign-intervention-by-section-501-c-3-tax-exempt-organizations

  Anyway, this is a good effort, but unless you get the petition into the media somehow with an organisation behind you, I cannot honestly see it having an effect.

  http://aawa.co/about-aawa/contact-us/

  Again, all the best. :)
  
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  33

  78 to go and hopefully something good comes of it. Please do your part and sign up. Thanks

  by Tenacious in

  1. watchtower
  2. child-abuse

  only 78 signatures are needed in order to send the request to the irs that they revoke or at the very least investigate the borg.

  come'on guys, support it.. click here to support and sign up!.

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  defender of truth

  Bump.

  I have forwarded this to several people, but can I make a suggestion?

  ". unyielding, dangerous, and outdated policies on shunning or excommunication known as disfellowshipping

  · child abuse

  · the banning of lifesaving blood transfusions that affect children which would classify them as a cult- like organization that fails to protect children, and causes harm to minors and the general health and well-being of the public."

  It is not the IRS's responsibility to investigate shunning, ie people not talking to each other, even the courts don't recognise shunning as illegal.

  Also, refusing blood transfusion is voluntary, the IRS are not going to investigate that either. They don't care about what a religion teaches, I am afraid. They don't define cults either, so maybe remove any uses of that word.

  I would suggest removing those parts, if the petition can be edited at all.

  "We, as current practicing as well as former members of this organization, as well as others who are not affiliated with this said organization, feel very passionately and strongly that these child abuse offences and outdated policies must come to light and deserves more coverage in mainstream media in the United States. "

  I would recommend just ending this sentence at 'feel very strongly about these child abuse offenses and outdated policies'.

  The IRS are not interested in you wanting coverage from the mainstream media.

  The UK charities commission were only willing to investigate due to the org's child abuse related policies. If you want any real chance of being listened to, maybe focus on just the child abuse partof your letter. (which is quite well written).

  Finally, you may need to get media coverage for the petition.

  Best of luck. :)
  
• 
  55

  Here's a view on homosexuality for you...

  by konceptual99 in

  1. watchtower
  2. beliefs

  ...right from a pro-jw site in response to a post about the relative seriousness of homosexuality.

  all you can do is reason from the scriptures, which you appear to have done.

  homosexuality is as serious as bestiality, or adultery and fornication.

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  defender of truth

  WT has continued to be compassionate, merciful, understanding, tolerant towards homosexual sinners, never hate or repulsion or rejection -always compassion mercy and understanding for the sinner but not the sin.
  

  @Fisherman, that is utter nonsense.

  There is nothing 'understanding' about the Watchtower's teaching that homosexuality is an abhorrent, deviant and immoral act.

  Young people are taught to not even think in a way that is in line with a homosexual preference, that acting on your homosexuality is abhorrent, and that anyone who practices those acts will be destroyed.

  There is nothing 'compassionate and tolerant' about the Watchtower's prescribed treatment of people who choose to live a homosexual lifestyle, namely disfellowshipping them and cutting them off from their family and friends.

  Gay Jehovah's Witnesses will only be shown the 'mercy' you refer to, if they reject their sexuality and live a celibate life. In other words, "we will forgive you and forget your abhorrent and deviant actions, just as long as you don't act on your feelings again, and fight to deny them constantly". Very loving(!)
  

  'Never repulsion' - Have you heard Anthony Morris III talk about the homosexuals as disgusting? (For wanting to see men in tight pants, for any who don't get the reference).

  'Never rejection' - Are you still talking here about the organization that will tell even members of a (practicing) homosexual Jehovah's Witnesses own family to not talk to them?!

  It is the Watchtower's doctrine of complete rejection of anyone practicing homosexuality, that has caused psychological distress to the point of some even feeling suicidal!!

  OK, rant over.
  
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  40

  New Article - Watchtower View of Homosexuality

  by jwfacts in

  1. watchtower
  2. beliefs

  i have thought about writing this article for many years, and the awake!

  2014 no.4 was the final straw.

  there it states that jehovah's witnesses show no prejudice towards homosexuals, and "they neither mock nor mistreat people whose practices differ from their own.

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  defender of truth

  Great article Jwfacts.

  All I can think of to add is this.

  In 2006 Kingdom news no.37 was distributed worldwide.

  http://wol.jw.org/en/wol/pc/r1/lp-e/1200273273/16/2

  Here are some parts of it that you might want to include:

  Kingdom News No. 37

  A Worldwide Message

  The End of False Religion Is Near!

  The fault lies, not with all religion, but with false religion. A widely respected religious figure, Jesus Christ, indicated that false religion produces bad works, just as a “rotten tree produces worthless fruit.” (Matthew 7:15-17) What fruit does false religion yield?

  False Religion . . .

  ▪ TOLERATES IMMORAL SEX: In Western lands, church groups ordain gay and lesbian members of the clergy and urge governments to recognize same-sex marriages. Even churches that condemn immorality have tolerated religious leaders who have sexually abused children. What, though, does the Bible teach? It plainly states: “Do not be misled. Neither fornicators, nor idolaters, nor adulterers, nor men kept for unnatural purposes, nor men who lie with men . . . will inherit God’s kingdom.” (1 Corinthians 6:9, 10) Do you know of religions that condone immoral sex?

  What does the future hold for religions that produce rotten fruit? Jesus warned: “Every tree not producing fine fruit gets cut down and thrown into the fire.” (Matthew 7:19) Yes, false religion will be chopped down and destroyed!

  http://wol.jw.org/en/wol/d/r1/lp-e/1102006290
  

  Not sure whether this could fit in anywhere, but I'm just putting it here, in case it's useful.